Out of Patients EP442: Faith, Fraud, and Finding Himself: Ben Unger
Ben Unger grew up Orthodox in Brooklyn and trained in Israel to become a rabbi. At 19 he told his community he was attracted to men. Their prescription: ritual baths, marriage to a woman, and this gem from his therapist. "If there's friction, it works."
He entered conversion therapy through JONAH, where grown men claimed they could cure him. Naked therapy circles. Tangerines as props. Exercises that belonged in deleted scenes from an 80s thriller.
Years later he helped sue them for consumer fraud. And won.
I wanted Ben on the show because Out of Patients interrogates power. Religion wrapped itself in authority and called abuse treatment. That structure feels familiar to anyone told to sit down, comply, and trust the experts.
His story forces a hard truth: institutions protect themselves first.
Listen. Then leave a review. Five stars help us reach more people who need these stories.
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Producer
Matthew Zachary invented healthcare podcasting before podcasting was a thing. In 2007, fresh off building Stupid Cancer, he grabbed a mic, launched The Stupid Cancer Show and started broadcasting patient stories on internet talk radio when everyone else was still writing blogs.
17 years and 400+ episodes later, Out of Patients is still the most unfiltered healthcare show anywhere.
Matthew doesn't do softball interviews. Brain cancer at 21 taught him that time is finite and bullshit is expensive. He gets guests to say things they'd never tell Congress. CEOs admit what's broken. Patients name what actually hurts. Scientists explain what industry doesn't want you to know. The conversations other shows won't touch because of sponsor concerns or political correctness.
What makes him different: He's been on both sides of the mic. Featured in documentaries, testified before Congress, keynoted hundreds of conferences.
But he's also been the guy puking from radiation, fighting insurance denials, and watching friends die from paperwork.
That dual perspective creates interviews you won't hear anywhere else. He knows which questions make power squirm because he's asked them from hospital beds and boardrooms both.
No pre-approved questions. No PR handlers. No seven-minute segments. Just real conversations with people brave enough to tell the truth about healthcare. After 17 years, Matthew's still the guy Mark Cuban reposts when he wants to understand what patients actually think. Read More
Out of Patients EP441: Defender Energy: Drew Flugstad-Clarke
